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Vincent and Catherine talking to Eric.

Question of the Day

What do you think?

Vincent tells Catherine what she loves is only part of him, and that she and Father wouldn't admit the truth of what he is even if it stood right in front of them. What are your thoughts? Is he right or wrong?

Winterfest is over and no new entries can be accepted. Here are the entries added during Winterfest.

 



Odile     2/4/2014 4:29:26 PM
Vincent a raison quand il dit que Catherine aime seulement une partie de lui-même : son côté humain. Mais quand il pense que Catherine ne connait pas son côté obscur (la bête), il se trompe. Elle sait très bien ce qu’il est. Elle l’a vu quand il tue. Elle sait ce que peuvent faire ses mains. Elle connait sa vraie nature. Même si elle n’aime pas ce côté violent, elle l’accepte car c’est une partie de lui. Elle aime trop Vincent. Elle ne peut pas le rejeter à cause de cette différence. Elle sait également que le côté obscur de Vincent ne lui fera jamais de mal. Enfin, elle croit au pouvoir de l’amour et espère en secret qu’elle pourra influencer Vincent, l’aider à contrôler et à dominer ce côté bestial ; L’aider à s’accepter tel qu’il est pour qu’il puisse sortir de sa souffrance. Père aussi connait le côté obscur de Vincent. Il en a peur. Il voudrait que Vincent se comporte comme un humain. Il pousse Vincent à contrôler cet instinct bestial, pour la sécurité de la communauté et la survie de Vincent. Vincent is right when he says that Catherine loves only a part of himself: his human side. But when he thinks that Catherine does not know his dark side ( the beast ) , he makes a mistake. She knows what he is. She saw him when he kills. She knows what may do his hands. She knows his true nature. Even if she does not like his violent side, she accepts it because it’s a part of him. She loves too Vincent. She can’t reject him because of this difference. She also knows that Vincent’s dark side will do her any harm. Finally, she believes in the power of love and hope in secret she might influence Vincent, help him to control and dominate his bestial side; Help him to accept as he is for going out of his suffering. Father also knows Vincent’s dark side. He is afraid of it. He wants Vincent to behaves as an human. He wants Vincent to control this bestial instinct for the community’s safety and Vincent’s survival.

Pat     2/4/2014 3:54:12 PM
Hi, S! It is true for us all that no one understands as we understand ourselves, and in Vincent's case, perhaps a bit more true. But even he does not understand himself, nor does he have any reference point as he is a truly unique being, to his and our knowledge at least! But that does not mean that Catherine or Father are incapable of seeing what he has shared so far of himself. I think the truth at the core for them both is love. What they see they love. They accept what they can learn about him. Vincent understands what Catherine is feeling through the Bond; perhaps Catherine's gift of the Bond is her certainty that through their connection, he can never harm her because she carries accepting love for him, and his Beast cannot give that up and will protect it at any cost to himself. So ultimately, I think they admit the truth of what they see as they see and understand it, not looking with rose-colored glasses at what they wished they saw. But, yes, they look through love.

Vicky     2/4/2014 5:12:34 AM
It is true neither Catherine nor Father nor Vincent himself fully know all about him, about all that he is. But I don't agree they (especially Catherine) don't admit or accept the truth of what they do know. Though I still think Father tends to avoid focus on other aspects but the man. My operative word is still "entirely," when I say I don't think he's entirely right. I think Catherine would still love any of that part of him he doesn't yet know or understand; but I'm not sure he believes that.

s     2/4/2014 2:31:58 AM
He is right. First, because this is said in Ceremony of Innocence. Maybe he wouldn't have said this, or this harshly, before the sudden dark turn that the show took with the Trilogy. Nobody can fully understand his nightmare in those episodes, just because nobody but Vincent is The Beast. Perhaps what he faced then was new even for himself, let alone Father or Catherine. In fact, had the series continued according to the original plan, not less than a "resurrection" was necessary to heal the Beast... But, second, Vincent is the Beast also before the Dark Turn, while the temptation for everyone, *especially* the fans, is to "normalize" him, and make of him a just a furry hulk, to treat like a normal man, and have expectations about him we'd have about a normal man. He is not. Only Catherine, and just thanks to the Bond, may have a better glimpse into his soul, but only into what *he* knows. And he does not know everything about himself either. He is The Creature There Has Never Been. We can put a pink ribbon around his neck and just drool over his voice and eyes, but... we are not seeing Vincent any more, precisely like he is saying in Ceremony of Innocence.

Nom-de-Guerre     2/3/2014 10:23:21 PM
His own self-loathing completely blinds him to the fact that they already DO see "all" of him and have already "accepted" it completely. Because HE, Vincent, finds his "dark" or "animal" side so loathsome and monstrous, he is actually, at this juncture anyway (his feelings on this evolve a bit later) unable to believe that Father and Catherine do NOT see that side of him as loathsome or monstrous. They see what HE sees-- the disconnect is that they interpret his "other" side very very differently than he does of course. Father and Catherine see Vincent as a whole, a whole entity, and whole, integrated human being with frailties and strengths like everyone else has, just a different nature and degree. They see his gestalt-- they see the whole package, "the measure of the man." But Vincent does not FEEL whole and cannot accept his "dark" side, so he explains away their "acceptance" to himself as just denial. He feels that if they TRULY SAW his "dark" side they could not help but hate and fear and reject it, ergo he concludes they must not really be allowing themselves to see it. The tragic truth is of course Father and Catherine love Vincent wholly and deeply, in a way he cannot love himself, so he cannot see himself as they see him. He believes that THEY must be "blind" to reality when in fact, it is, tragically, Vincent himself who suffers from this destructive blindness. His perspective on himself is missing some big pieces, whereas Father and Catherine can see the whole "big picture" of Vincent in his entirety. It is the central tragedy of the story.

truelovewaits     2/3/2014 6:32:00 PM
He is wrong. They both know him and have seen the human/beast sides of him and still love him in spite of everything! However, they both have been exposed to certain situations that he was involved or concerned with. From Vincent protecting Catherine she has gotten to see more of the killings than Father has and understands and accepts him for all that he is. Father has been there with him in his illness when he was younger and has seen what Paracelsus did to him when he turned violent but hasn't seen him kill like Catherine has. Father said himself to Vincent, "There is nothing terrible in you." Vincent doesn't believe him but he insists on it, because his struggles and pain is greater than anyone else's. Both Father and Catherine have been exposed differently to Vincent concerning his beast side but are at peace with who he is to them.

poetrymischief     2/3/2014 6:09:24 PM
He is right. He is after all part beast. Perhaps there are moments of feelings that Vincent has always successfully hidden from others. Catherine cannot read his innermost thoughts, as evidenced by the several times she has to plead with him, "Vincent TELL me what you are feeling." And if Catherine can't read them, then no one else can either. And I believe that Father and Catherine would not want to admit the truth. Very few people can admit to the flaws of loved ones. Love is Blind after all. That doesn't mean she doesn't love him completely.

Edith     2/3/2014 4:47:53 PM
I would say he was wrong. He has a handsome face and body. The only person that has to look at reality is him.

Emily     2/3/2014 4:30:29 PM
I think because of the Bond, Catherine and Vincent are closer to each other than anyone else Above or Below is. Which means they know and experience the dark and the light within each other and themselves, though, to what extent.... I think that is what Vincent is worried about. I think the more of Vincent Catherine is exposed to, the more she will love, not less. It's true love after all! :)

Judith N.     2/3/2014 1:05:51 PM
Catherine would love all and accept all. And she would teach him to accept that which cannot be changed. We all have our "dark" side.

Kindra     2/3/2014 11:54:10 AM
Catherine loves all of him. She has seen the dark part of him when he has killed and she still loves him. Vincent is the one that hasn't accepted all aspects of himself.

Rusty / RedNightBird     2/3/2014 8:39:21 AM
Vincent's insecurities are speaking here....She loves all of him. Only a woman in love can see and accept all of him.

Paula     2/2/2014 9:11:47 PM
I believe in his mind because he could not accept the "other half" no one else could and love him because of that... I believe Catherine loved all of him because she saw all of him, the good with the bad...

Kathy De     2/2/2014 7:36:56 PM
I think he's wrong. No one knows him better than Father and Catherine. Father because he was involved in every aspect of Vincent's life and Catherine because she has also seen him at his worse and fearlessly faced him every time

underthepark     2/2/2014 7:27:22 PM
He is wrong. Because Father as well as Catherine have seen his "other side", and they accept and love him as he is.

Janet R.     2/2/2014 3:22:03 PM
Both. I think Catherine is quite aware of all sides of Vincent; she seen it and accepts it, but I think Father is downright confused and confusing. When he tells Catherine that only part of Vincent is a man he is thinking one way, but I think he's sometimes in denial about what the part of Vincent he considers not to be a man is capable of doing. I think he sees what he wants to see when it is convenient and agrees with his opinions.

Sharon     2/2/2014 2:40:47 PM
He is wrong. Catherine and Father love All of Vincent! Both of proven that thru the best and worst of situations!!

Susie     2/2/2014 1:35:37 PM
I think he is wrong. Catherine loves everything about him. Father may think sometimes about him but loves him just the same.

Rosemarie S.     2/2/2014 11:57:51 AM
I think he is mostly wrong. Father does give a lot of mixed messages, and it does have a lot to do with how he feels about himself. Others in his life may accept "all" of him in whatever relationship they have. But C, wanting a romantic relationship, is truly going further than anyone has before in accepting all of him. There is plenty of evidence that she is very serious. The line "I see the man that I love" really convinced me. She may have used the word man, but implied in the way - and time - she said it was that she was accepting all of him, no matter what she has or hasn't seen yet.

Manu     2/2/2014 10:20:18 AM
Nein ich denke nicht das er recht hat. Denn Catherine kennt die andere Seite von Vincent und hat sie immer akzeptiert. Das hat sie ja schon einige Male bewiesen. Sie hat sich nie von ihm abgewandt. Auch Vater wußte immer das es auch eune dunkle Seite in ihm gibt

M.     2/2/2014 10:04:43 AM
I think Fathers words lend him to thinkthat there may never be someone. So to trust is difficult. And sometimes slow. So when it could be is not easy to believe in himself. How could another? She had her work cut out for her. Someones self-awareness that isn`t high to begin.

Vicky     2/2/2014 9:37:31 AM
The fact that Catherine tells him "I see the man I love," for instance, doesn't mean she's overlooking or don't want to admit anything, it only means she also sees that parto f him, and not only what he considers his dark places. Vincent claims she doesn't understand or see all of him, but when she tries to, he shuts her out (The Outsiders come to mind). She loves all of him; I believe not even Father has seen or knows so much about those dark moments as she has. Yes, Father was there during that horrible illness when he was young, but I doubt he has ever had to take Vincent's bloody hands after watching everything those hands could do... So no, I don't think he's entirely right.

Cordi     2/2/2014 9:17:30 AM
Catherine hat ihn schon in so vielen Situationen gesehen, wo sich ein anderer abgewendet hätte und hat immer zu ihm gestanden ... ja, er liegt falsch!Ich glaube es fällt Vincent einfach nur schwer zu glauben, dass es Menschen gibt, die ihn einfach so lieben wie er ist. Er kennt seine dunklen Seiten, er weiß, dass er auch tötet um zu Leben. -------- Yes he is wrong, Catherine has seen him so much situations and she's still with him. I think Vincent he said this only because he's afraid of himself, he knows his dark sides and knows that he also kills to live and he cannot imagine that someone can love him like he really is, with all ups and downs.

Kuli     2/2/2014 7:46:04 AM
Vincent has to believe that they only love part of him because he himself cannot accept that other side. And with Father, there may be a certain amount of truth in the accusation, as there are things he prefers not to acknowledge. But I think Vincent finds Catherine's "thorns and all" love to be very frightening because he wants it more than anything, but his every other experience of love/acceptance (except possibly Devin, who scarpered) has hinged on certain conditions, on never losing his hold and never revealing that inhuman side of himself where it might frighten others. If Catherine is all that is good and light in his world, then she could not be anything besides repulsed and horrified by the savage darkness that is a part of him. To keep her loving friendship, he tries not to let her see what he knows she must reject. When she sees and doesn't reject, he has to believe it's because she won't admit what she's seen. The stakes in accepting the alternative, that she knows and loves him still, are just too high to be borne, because if he's wrong, he loses her.

Regina     2/2/2014 7:55:35 AM
Very good Question! All the answer are good. I feel this is Vincent fear speak of what he is to his eyes...

T'Mara     2/2/2014 6:44:15 AM
I think he is right and wrong at the same time. Right, since it is obvious that he is different and one can never know what other, hitherto unknown, talents or potentially dangerous traits lie dormant within his genetic make-up. But he is also wrong, since he is a sentient being with a free will, thus able to shape his own destiny, which includes relationships.

LauraG     2/2/2014 5:07:30 AM
For all that they're in New York, Father may reside in a state called Denial, but Catherine doesn't. She's seen him release that other part of himself - she knows exactly what it is. From that first time in the brownstone when he killed to protect her, Catherine has known, accepted and loved Vincent.

Pat     2/2/2014 4:24:01 AM
I think Vincent is mostly wrong. Yes, we can sometimes be blind to faults in those we love, but I don't believe Catherine or Father are especially blind to Vincent. They know about Vincent what Vincent is willing to share or show about himself; they love unconditionally, so that whatever he shows they will accept. Doesn't mean they won't worry about it for his sake, but nothing revealed would change that love. In his rearing of Vincent as a child, Father may have emphasized the human side of Vincent because that is what he understood. He was careful of Vincent's differences for safety's sake, not for denying them to others in the community. Father wants to help and his frustration comes from not knowing what he can do for Vincent, not in denying what's in front of him. Catherine wants to be with Vincent in a loving relationship and her frustration comes from Vincent not sharing those sides of himself he fears she might reject him for, and Catherine is also frustrated that Vincent can't seem to believe that she could love all of him without having seen all of his 'beast' side. What she does know, she loves; she cannot imagine anything he could reveal that would alter that.

Walkingmiracle     2/2/2014 12:35:27 AM
I think he's a little bit of both. First off, he's right because they are both bias because they love him. Generally speaking when you love someone you tend to see the best in them, while ignoring their flaws. He's also partially wrong for a similar reason. Even though they love him they have both seen the dark side of him and what he's capable of when he allows/has to allow it to come out. Despite knowing the truth Catherine loves ALL of him because as she tells him through their bond they share everything. There is a darkness in everyone that shows itself in different ways. Catherine and Father know this and that's why it's so easy for them to love ALL of Vincent.

Ruby     2/2/2014 12:13:17 AM
Father may only love part of him, but Catherine loves him whole. She does not run away or try to brush off when he attacks others. She sees in him something that has never been and loves it.

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